I’m not a local

A remark from CCP Explorer on Twitter has seen a flurry of commentary on “fixing local”.  Rhavas has a reasonable starting point with links to further reading:


The arguments are slowly getting more sophisticated, and I have previously read ideas that I have liked, and which would be worthwhile additions to the game.


However, cut though the fluff and carry on, and what is the main problem many of these people have with Local?

Be honest about it.

They think local makes it too easy for people to avoid PVP.

So the goal of many of the suggestions is to make PVP – if not easier, at least more likely.


The two main perceived issues with local are also remarked on as the benefits:

. It is too easy to gather intelligence

. If you are alert, you can use it to stay relatively safe

To my mind there are two additional benefits – it is available to everyone, and it can prompt interaction between players.


When I read suggestions on how to improve local, these are some of the questions I am asking:

. Is the concept simple and easy to understand?

. Will the mechanism be quick and straightforward to use?

. Will there be any variation through skills to train, ship hull bonuses, or modules that relate to ship, POS, Station or Sovereignty?

. Will it be influenced by the finesse and ability of the end user, such as is possible now with D-SCAN or Probe use?

. Over time, is it likely to increase, leave unchanged, or decrease the average population of impacted systems?

This last point is important.  Make each system a nirvana for Pirates and you get, well, just Pirates.


Wormholes have no local.  You are required to use D-Scan, Probes and caution.  The danger of almost inevitable loss is offset by the possibility of greater riches, and the fact the pathways between systems are restricted and random.

Take local away from low sec, and it becomes less appealing to your standard hauling / trading / PVE / just taking a short cut / Miner target.  Replace it with a mechanism which is annoying and too untrustworthy to use, and people stop playing in those areas.


I am not against changing local – I just want it to enhance the game.  I figured I should throw out an example – this is just off the top of my head and I haven’t thought it through.

No local – but two new high slotted modules.

The first is Passive Radar.

It has a range of 15AU, plus 5AU per rank in a skill.

It updates a small overview map every 10 seconds, minus 1 second per rank in a skill.

It shows planets, moons, POS, stations and uncloaked ships.  You can’t warp to the POS or ships, it just show approximate location.

The ship details get more refined per rank in a skill – so rank 1 it just shows a blip for a single or group of ships, rank 2 might show the number of ships, rank 3  small, medium or large, rank 4 might be frigate, destroyer, cruiser etc, rank 5 might be the specific hull type – Corax, Coercer, Sabre etc

You can turn this into an active radar – it updates more frequently, but it uses cap and your signature is blown out.

The second is a Sonar.

Similar in function and skill impact to the Radar, but it provides much less range and detail, but includes cloaked ships.  It also blows out your signature.

Maybe make it possible for one ship to feed this inforation to others within its fleet – or possible a POS or Sovereignty module which might do the same.

There seem to be some interesting concepts in that – but rather obviously I doubt it would work from a lag point of view, particularly with large numbers of ships in system (maybe it summaries details once gangs get greater than 20 hulls).  Many pilots may simply not have the screen real estate to have an extra window open like that all the time.  I’m not championing this – I am just trying to think of something that might make losing local seem worthwhile.

But – and I harp on this over and over again, if you really want more targets to fall under your guns – then focus on measures to increase the number of them wanting to risk fly around in your space.  Do you really think removing local will do that?

9 thoughts on “I’m not a local

  1. Local intel just makes ppl lazy. Removing local/delayed local can make it easier for the ganker/roaming fleet entering the system, but harder to get local intel as well. So it’s very funny that when two roaming fleet try to find eachother, local provides the insta intel. Same thing as low sec 1/10 2/10, certian groups of ppl rely on that scout-free feature to pvp. (Do they rlly care about the sites behind the gate?)

    • I don’t think Local is a lazy option. I’ve spent more than a couple years in Null Sec, and keeping an eye on multiple intel channels, local, and whatever PVE or the like you are doing, can keep you busy. At the same time, I don’t mind if an interesting alternative is put in its place. However – make it too hard core, and you will end up with less targets in those areas and less PVP, which seems to defeat the purpose of the change.

      • WH life don’t have local, and wh life is fine. Of course the anomaly mechanism force ppl to loot/slavage, do tedious logi for isk, thus provide more ganking opportunity. But remember, CCP don’t like passive income. If wh dweller need to check d-scan every 30 sec even sitting in a ladar site; need to use combat probes/cloaky scout at the dynamic “gate” everytime they do sites, why can’t K-scpace do the same? Is AFK mining rlly the way ppl like playing the game? Is FOF tengu + SC assgin fighter AFK farming a legit way to make tons of isk 24/7? CCP has a long way to go, of course, local and d-scan is only part of the problem.

      • As I have said, the rewards are higher in WH space, and travel is through limited (both in number and mass) and random paths. Still – if it is so great, why is the overall WH population such a relatively small percentage of subscribers? If CCP arbitrarily took Local away from K-Space, what do you think would happen?

        You remark on “problems” – but what are they, and who are they problems for? Is it for the Hardcore PVP player? Would you want to hazard a guess at just how many of those play the game? I think you would be surprised at how small a percentage it is.

        I want the game to cater to as many play styles as possible with synergy between them. If you want a new local mechanism, find one that improves the game for the majority of people, and encourages new players to join because it is “cool”. Make the game perfect for you – and you will end up just playing it with a small number of people just like you.

      • Many ppl hate wh because its “scary localess” feature LOL. But seriously wh is NOT the “end game” / “elite only part” of eve. And the avg income of a C1/C2 is not that great comparing to null sec ratting or even hs LV4 mission. C3/C4 is little bit better than hs lv4 mission, but if you are scanning deadspace in low/null you probably could make much more (if you are lucky). Whatever you do in wh, you can’t do it while you are AFK. I think that’s part of the problem of K-space in EVE. I’m just an ordinary casual eve player so I’m not going to tackle the rest of the problem like “why bot can be better than actual player in some way”,or “you need to play like a bot to max your isk/hr”.
        IF, only IF there’s no local/delayed local in null/low, who will stop playing the game? If we can still read statistics in starmap with nice detailed API output to dotlan so you can find where’s ppl ratting, how’s the local traffic, will it be difficult for small gang to find eachother? If we can introduce FW capture like feature in low(you can make decent isk from it, but you have to fight other players), will low sec attract more ppl to live in/dropping by? If there’s more reward to scan down the gravi sites in high/low, and the rats can eat you alive if you don’t do it right, will the corp start recruiting industry as well as combat player, other than the army of alts?
        Of course cloaky will be kind of OP (SB ganker alrdy got nerfed afther AI patch, and the cov-ops scanner don’t have the ability to solo anything; blockate runner might be relatively safe if there’s no gatecamp oh wait), and botter can simply make cloaky alts watching star gates to gathering intel. But there’ll be no bitching about afk cloaky anymore. We could tweek the stargate delay (after 15sec jump in, you’ll show up on local for couple minutes, no jump out intel ) to make it more fun 🙂

  2. Democrats pointing fingers at republicans; republicans pointing fingers at democrats; miners pointing fingers at gankers; pvpers pointing fingers at PVE-ers. Everyone wants it easy. What they don’t understand is if they get it all their way, the game will become boring and monotonous. If miners (not bot miners) could truly shoot rocks and ice 23/7 without any lingering danger, I think they’d fall away from the game in a matter of a month.
    If pirates had anymore easy targets to shoot at…well I guess that’s not really a valid arguement because pirates can literally sit at a gate all day long waiting for a defenseless ship coming through and call it pvp and be happy with it.
    If you want more pvp, go LOOKING. Or do what the New Order sheep are doing and blow up Mackinaws in ice fields. Or go to nullsec and join a blob. Or RvB and get your shoot on.
    The only reason it seems they complain is that they don’t want anything that can shoot back. And if it can shoot back the pirates would rather it be a PVE-fitted ship.
    This is of course my opinion, but I get a bit tired of reading the whining about “we don’t have anyone to shoot at”. There are places where people are shooting at each other and there are pretty explosions…go there.

    • At various times Providence has provided what I think is the microsystem well suited to roaming PVP’ers. The more carebear types, mixed in with the inexperienced, play at building sand castles and have fun. Hostiles – not interested in the land itself, roam through culling the inattentive and unlucky, and get to skirmish against the defensive fleets. It is the type of synergy that I think people should focus on – allowing as many play styles to fit in together, instead of trying to force one single play style on everyone.

  3. Pingback: Unbreaking Local – An EVE Intel System Proposal | Interstellar Privateer
  4. Pingback: The Local Nexus | Mabrick's Mumblings

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